Shop Floor Talk  

Go Back   Shop Floor Talk > Welding and Metalworking Forums > Shop & Safety

SFT Search:   
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 12-20-2007, 12:28 AM
Sberry's Avatar
Sberry Sberry is offline
GOD of Strawberries!!!
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,799
Default

I have never came across a common home where a 200A service was overloaded, never really see 100's overloaded although they could be considering air cond, etc., seen a 60 run a house with all electric appliances.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-27-2016, 05:37 PM
MegaShop MegaShop is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 5
Default Breaker Box Help

I wouldnt think that it would over load the house. One good idea is to label your breaker box and write down the amps. You can get the set for only $4.95 with free shipping. Can't beat it.


https://steellabels.com/make-breaker-box-better/
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-27-2016, 09:17 PM
bigb bigb is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Arizona
Posts: 56
Default

What no one seemed to notice in the orginal photo (the link still works)was that there are no stabs next to that main and no way to clip a breaker on, so there is no way the OP ever put his breaker there but then he never came back to say what happened anyway. But I am guessing your reason for dragging up a nine year old thread was for something other than further discussion of the original question.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-28-2016, 01:03 AM
Norcal Norcal is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: California
Posts: 944
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by R Funk View Post
There are 3 issues that come to play in a situation like this:

1) What does the manufacturer say. In other words does the UL listing of the panel include a breaker in that position? Read the info on the inside of the panel/panel cover or go out on the web. The information should be there on the manufacurer's site.

2) You need to go through the National Electric Code (NEC) calculations for the connected load and application. This is carefully laid out in the NEC. These calculated values are usually well under 50% of the connected load (sum of all loads conected)

3) The actual measured load on the panel. It will most likely be well below the capacity of the main breaker and probably below the NEC calcualtions.

Editorial Note: It is amazing how low the total typical electrical load on panel is due to diversity of the load. Most of us will not be running a welder, drill press, plasma burner etc at the same time. Go to to Harbor Freight and buy their amp meter (I paid $10.00 or $12.00 for mine if I remember correctly but is now superceded by a $100 meter I purchased later) and measure the typical amp draw. Of course I should recomend a Fluke or other major US company but you will spend almost 10 times more. However I found the HF meter's performance suprisingly acceptable.

Buy the way to pass UL listing the breaker must trip at no more than 120% of rated load after 30 minutes. I doubt if you will continously load the main at full load for more than 5 minutes at a time or so....

Unofficial Comment: Is the electrical inspector going to be involved? If not install it (if allowed by the panel manufacturer) and let her rip. Most panels are so lightly loaded in typical non industrial applications the main will never trip. If it does what does it hurt as long as you don't have your mother in law on life suport equipment in the house or your wife is in a bad mood, if this panel feeds your house also? However make certain that you still follow the NEC for the materials and workmanship.

Trust this helps
There will not be much info from the manufacturer since Challenger has been gone for around 20 years & they built shitty panels too, but there is not enough of a bus stab to install another branch breaker next to the backfed main, the only breakers to my knowledge that are UL classified to fit Challenger panels are Eaton (formerly Cutler-Hammer) since OEM breakers are no longer made. Since this is a old thread, if someone needed to add a breaker, then check if the panel has notched bus stabs, and if so get a couple of twin breakers & use them replace 4 single pole breakers which will leave 2 spaces open for a 240 volt feed.

OEM circuit breakers are UL listed for the same make of panel, some makes are UL classified to be used in some competitive makes, such as Eaton and Siemens make UL classified replacements for SQ D QO breakers, but no SQ D breaker is classified to be used in competitive panels, if a SQ D HOM, is found in a ITE/ Siemens, GE, Bryant/Westinghouse/Cutler-Hammer/ Eaton BR,or Murray, panels then there is a sure sign that hack electrical work has been done.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-28-2016, 09:30 AM
bigb bigb is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Arizona
Posts: 56
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norcal View Post
get a couple of twin breakers & use them replace 4 single pole breakers which will leave 2 spaces open for a 240 volt feed.
This is a big problem around here due to AC installers and "handy" people in general having no clue about multi-wire circuits. Eventually 210.4(B) may help but in reality I see even that as a futile "fool proofing" measure.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-28-2016, 04:58 PM
LKeithR's Avatar
LKeithR LKeithR is offline
Hey...wait...is there a prize?
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Langley, B.C.
Posts: 4,025
Default

Here's the image from PhotoBucket so everyone knows what's going on...
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Breakerbox.jpg
Views:	96
Size:	84.0 KB
ID:	137223  
__________________
Keith

Measure twice and cut once...or...wait, was that the other way around?
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-29-2016, 12:43 AM
Norcal Norcal is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: California
Posts: 944
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigb View Post
This is a big problem around here due to AC installers and "handy" people in general having no clue about multi-wire circuits. Eventually 210.4(B) may help but in reality I see even that as a futile "fool proofing" measure.
A/C installers should not be allowed to touch electrical, they come under the same category as handyhacks.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-29-2016, 05:09 PM
Bender's Avatar
Bender Bender is offline
One Lone Sub
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Nampa, ID
Posts: 4,841
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norcal View Post
A/C installers should not be allowed to touch electrical, they come under the same category as handyhacks.
Whew, lucky for me I'm a painter
__________________
Boise Paint Contractor
Facebook
How fortunate we are!
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-29-2016, 06:55 PM
terry lingle's Avatar
terry lingle terry lingle is online now
Something's Fishy ...
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Birch Island, BC, Canada
Posts: 4,405
Default

Most people should stay away from electrical for simple safety reasons.
Today i installed a custom furnace controller for a dual fuel hot water heating system. The customer has wired an extension cord into a Gundfoss circulator pump three wires line neutral and ground into a clearly marked terminal block he went 0 for 3 white on the ground , green on the line and black on the neutral . No sparks and it rotated so it must be correct
__________________
Life beats the alternative hands down.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-29-2016, 07:16 PM
Bender's Avatar
Bender Bender is offline
One Lone Sub
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Nampa, ID
Posts: 4,841
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by terry lingle View Post
Most people should stay away from electrical for simple safety reasons.
Today i installed a custom furnace controller for a dual fuel hot water heating system. The customer has wired an extension cord into a Gundfoss circulator pump three wires line neutral and ground into a clearly marked terminal block he went 0 for 3 white on the ground , green on the line and black on the neutral . No sparks and it rotated so it must be correct
Great way to learn the 60 cycle shuffle
__________________
Boise Paint Contractor
Facebook
How fortunate we are!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Web Search:

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.