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Old 02-13-2007, 10:31 AM
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JohnBoy JohnBoy is offline
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Default Shop designup/buildup

I've decided to build a shop.

i was gonna get a few containers but the hassle of getting rid of them in 3 years time when we go to sell our house outweighs any possible benifits.

So i'm building a garage.

I don't want to have to apply for planning, as that will get expensive quickly, they'll want me to build something in the same style as my house, which is rendered concrete block walls with natural slate roof, which is all expensive for a shed.

So i'm gonna build a planning exempt garage. the exemption from planning allows the following.
25SqM in floorspace
4M A roof peak if roof is tiled or slated, 3m if not tiled or slated or not an A roof.

to translate thats 269 sq feet and a 13 foot ridge

I want this to look nice and add value to the property so i'm gonna go with a slated roof, but with synthetic slates as opposed to natural.
I figure the optimal breakdown of 269 sq feet is 19'6"x13'9"

I'll put in an insulated slab and build 3 steel frames. put in a single run of blocks at ground level then timber frame sheeted in OSB with battens and wooden cladding outside.
timber rafters with slates on top.

insulate in the walls and between the rafters and slab out the inside with a ten foot ceiling in the middle

relatively big double doors in one end, with a walk in door in one side and small non opening windows on two walls for light but with security.

I've been mulling over it for some time now and have started drawing it up so i decided to post the design and buildup here.

all design is being done using google sketchup, i really like it. its quite easy to use after a bit of playing around

my first pic is of the slab and steel frame
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  #2  
Old 02-13-2007, 11:30 AM
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This is great, Johnboy.
It will be really interesting to be able to watch how it's done in Eire.
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  #3  
Old 02-13-2007, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cutter
This is great, Johnboy.
It will be really interesting to be able to watch how it's done in Eire.
well to be honest cutter this is very much me picking and choosing from various types of building systems, but the end product won't be very typical of here at all.

in ireland almost all sheds are steel framed sheeted in box profile, often with block or mass concrete walls up to about six feet.

this will be much more of an american style building, the only reason i'm using the steel A frames is because i'm not confident that i'd be able to make suitably strong wooden trusses with the crossmember up so high. i feel the steel gives me that little bit extra strength.

I'd love to hear any suggestions anyone wants to make that don't involve increasing the floor area or the height
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Old 02-13-2007, 12:16 PM
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Not so much a suggestion, but rather a question... What are the standard lumber sizes over there? Similar to American standards, with metric measurements or are they set to a metric standard?
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Old 02-13-2007, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dubby
Not so much a suggestion, but rather a question... What are the standard lumber sizes over there? Similar to American standards, with metric measurements or are they set to a metric standard?
depends

we are very much mixed over here. most stuff is bought by the end users as four by two or whatever but its actually being stocked by the merchant as 100x45

timber is traded between merchants in cubic metres normally.

I tend to use a horrible mix of imperial and metric, i don't know why but i think in imperial for timber and metric for steel. really annoying.

the frame of this building is currently planned on being 100x50 box and 4x2 timber

we also wouldn't have the range of sizes of lumber that ye have as we don't really build much out timber
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Old 02-13-2007, 12:45 PM
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I was wondering how you are going to heat your shop ? And if you had thought about it yet , One of my neighbors is in the process of tearing up his concrete floors to put heat in radiant floor heat , he wanted three big Reznor gas heaters when he built the place but soon he realized it was too hard to keep an even temperature with the heaters cycling on and off . And the gas bill is killing him . Think heat now before you get the slab poured . Dan
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Old 02-13-2007, 03:35 PM
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I think you are being far too conservtive.
At 15 x 20 feet you are bulidng something smaller than what we would call a one car garage.
Go here for some truss plans.

http://www.public.iastate.edu/~mwps_.../tr_plans.html

It dosn't matter if you build with wood or steel, the weak points in any building is at the joints. Most often, where wall meets roof.
Forget the steel, go with wood walls and trusses. If you are worried about high winds (Hurrcane) then tie the walls and trusses together with 45 degree pieces going from the studs, about 2 foot down from the top plate, and up to the truss bottom chord.
It will be stronger than 90 % of the sheds over here.
Just space the trusses close enough to take what ever roofing load you put on them.
You don't have to worry too much about snow load over there, do you?
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Old 02-13-2007, 06:17 PM
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14' x 20' can work out to be a nice shop. My old shop was 10' x 18' due to space. Everything on wheels to move in and out of the 10' x 10' slab in front of the shop.

Before the big shop went up, my wife asked for a "Garden Shed" for all the lawn tools, kids bikes, etc. She thought 8' x 10' would work. I knew better.

18' x 24' -- space is divied into quarters: Storage, lawn tools, wife's potting stuff, kids projects.

Stick framing on 16" o.c. Metal hurricane ties. We've had winds in excess of 95mph. (Jarrel the F5 tornado wasn't too far up the road, btw).

Rafters were commercial. 18' wide, working by myself. Since they are 2' apart, I used spacers 22.5" to fit between them. I would hang the rafter upside down (ridge down) attach the spacers to the rafter, and use a 10' 2x4 to "flip them" into place.

Front was finished with brick to match the house (ditto for the big shop).

Nice thing about an over sized "garden shed" keeps the wife and kids "stuff" from piling into the big shop!
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  #9  
Old 02-13-2007, 10:37 PM
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Good for you, JohnBoy - we love shop threads!
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  #10  
Old 02-14-2007, 04:33 AM
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Lu47Dan:

No plans to heat it at all. Body heat will be more than enough, we have a very temperate climate here, below zero for maybe 5 days a year and above thirty for maybe another five days (thats celcius/centigrade btw, I may do inches and feet, but i sure as hell don't do farenheit)

It will simply be insulated, which is more than any other shed i've worked in has had. at my folks place where i have my land rover i work in an openfronted haybarn.


kbs2244:

I agree, I'm being way too conservative. What i'm building is what we would call a one car garage, but our cars are smaller. These however are the constraints i have to work within. I could build a bigger building but then i'd have to go get planning permission from the county council, and they will insist on concrete block construction, with a cement render, pvc double glazed windows and doors to match the house and a natural slate roof. a 20x30 building with a 10 foot eave would cost me in the region of $50k
money i don't have, nor do i want to spend on a shop i'll be in for 3 or 4 years.

pic of house: the building would have to look and be basically built the same


hurricanes and snow load aren't really issues here. thanks for the truss diagrams however they start kinda big plus they don't meet my one requirment which is to have the horizontal member of the A frame above the wall level as i will only have an 8'6" wall but i want to have a ceiling of 10 foot in the middle. if you know what i mean.. and i can't go with much shallower a pitch than 30 degrees with a slate roof so i can't raise the eave to ten foot.

everyone else, thanks for the interest and keep the suggestions coming.

this last pic is of the site, as it was when we moved in last april. the shed will be build behind the two small mountain ash trees half way down the garden just behind those small bushes there
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Last edited by JohnBoy; 02-14-2007 at 12:11 PM.
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